Mama always said nothin' good happens after midnight....

And to think Juanita's has applied to have liquor until 5 a.m....

Hope that application dies a quick death!

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Good riddance. Excellent police work. Hopefully this will happen often enough that these thugs will move on to greener pastures (not near my home).

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And now the newly transplanted Juanita's wants to stay open until 5 a.m. in that same area. Stupid! How long will Stodola and his real estate backers continue to fob off the notion that the River Market area is not a breeding ground for crime?

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LOWER TAXES AND MORE GUNS ARE THE ONLY THING THAT WILL FIX THIS.

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A five AM bar in the river market is the worst idea ever.

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It's OK Max, if we throw enough money at our Galtian overlords they will use it to invest in factories and machines and that will produce jobs and taxes and that will give the hoodlums something productive and pay for more cops for those who don't want to be productive.

It's worked fine for the past 30 years, all we have to do is keep piss... err throwing the money. (Never mind those factories opening outside our borders.)

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More immigrant operated C-stores selling 40ouncers and 4-loko to the thugs and wannabes will solve the problem. Look at all of the job's they're providing to the youth of the community to keep them off the streets and learn good work skills.

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No Arizona state senators involved, I hope.

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This makes me so sad to hear this is happening at home. I am in Hawaii and there are bad things in 'town' at Honolulu and this sounds like the same *#)$! When I was in my 20's, I used to wish that LR would have a downtown area by the river like Memphis did. A cool place to hang out. Now it is there and I am older and don't want to go to bars and such and guess it is a good thing for my safety. So sad.

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All this before the crime bill kicks in.


It will get worse...

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I don't frequent LR, but surely there are several police patrolling the River Market area? I just came from Oklahoma City and there is a substantial police substation located in their Bricktown downtown bar/sports arena/baseball stadium area. It's not hard to find a cop on Dickson Street either.

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I agree that more police, especially in areas we promote drinks + late night, are long overdue. Looks like they should deny juanitas 5 am not just due to this sad event, due to it being the wrong place wrong time.

If we know this a problem area, then the big promoters, Tucker, Moses, kumpuris,etc, should be ar more vocal regarding great protection an attention

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I think more crime is happening in the River Market than is reported, received an e-mail just last week from a friend's young adult child, getting in his car after a concert at a pay lot right on Pres. Clinton Ave. they had noticed a group of men loitering near the lot, as he got in the car 2 guys from the group got in the car with them and started beating them. Robbery attempt? Who knows. They were able to drive away with the guys finally "falling by the way side"....no way would I go down there after dark[ well perhaps with a police escort].
Surely the business community down there is up in arms...definately bad for business.

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I am shocked, SHOCKED, that there would be crime in downtown LR in the River Market area.

Lessons learned from this experience:

1. The River Market area is a target-rich environment for criminals. If you're there, you are definitely a potential target. It is to your benefit to realize this early and act accordingly.

2. The cops can't, and won't, be everywhere at once. The city cannot afford to put a huge police presence downtown just to protect people in that area. To do so would pull officers from other areas that also need a police presence, and would also likely lead to an outcry from the public *because* there are "too many" police around.

3. Your personal safety is *your* responsibility. You can't carry a cop on your back, and they are not your personal security detail. If you're not able/willing to evaluate your surroundings and make good decisions based on that information, your chance of being a crime victim is increased.

Just because we're now living on pavement doesn't mean there aren't still lions among the gazelles. Ignore that fact at your own peril.

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If the majority of crimes in the Rivermarket is by black/African Americans then why not call it as it is? Shying away from a double take, crime and predominantly black causing it is less a racial comment..it more a testimony acknowledging the problem of crime and the fact that it is disproportionately by blacks.

If we discuss this with eyes wide open, then tough titties...it is what it is.

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I agree that "it is what it is," but I haven't seen the stats that show what it is -- certainly not in this post.

And if what it is, is "everybody knows it's the blacks doing the crimes..."

Alrighty, then.

But Max, the scary criminal assault and battery described by the young man doesn't appear to have been a "robbery," or even an "attempted robbery." Seems that reports of robbery by groups of 10-15 young men and when are fairly rare -- too many witnesses who might end up "snitching," and too many hands out for a cut, I suppose. Most robbers make their demands known right away, and don't waste time banging on your hood when it is clear you're going to get away.

As Goodbye, South posits, this particular crime seems rooted in nonverbal communication or something else we don't know. But the post certainly describes a crime; I hope the offenders are caught.

I have been pondering what a concealed weapon would have added to the mix for the victims. I suppose it would have made them less afraid for their safety. Anything more is just speculation, so I'll keep my speculation to myself.

Anyway, interesting that in the police shooting, reports say that several officers "heard" gunshots and were close enough to give chase and encounter a fleeing possible suspect with a gun. Sounds like there was police presence at that point. I do not know that we could expect more.

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Lesson learned from Art Vandalay:
a late-night, target-rich environment with lots of people isn't a good place for police presence

Thanks, Costanza.

Maybe there is already a reasonable number of police in the area, I don't know. Is there a visible presence at the River Market?

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Haahaa. Ae you living under a rock? Go to LRPD and check out last years river market crime report....it right there. Talk to the police, off the record and you will be appalled.

Mob acts happen all of the time. I go to the river market weekly and I've seen first hand plenty to back it up. Skip Rutherford twitter today describing what he referred to as a "war zone." The patience is thin, it's time to address the larger problems, the systemic problems and this is an offshoot of one aspect of it.

I've witnessed plenty of times were groups of blacks act in an intimidating manner...many many times and to deny this is either naive or disingenuous at best. I'm sorry that a segment of our population has degenerated disproportionately and I'm willing to continue doing my part to have an honest discussion to fix, yet to deny the facts and truths just because it is either politically incorrect or uncomfortable..those days need to be behind us in order to help fix the problem. Or at least attempt to fix it.

It is not unique it LR, yet it is a fairly large and serious problem. Race is a word, the color of skin a criminal is that commits a crime or makes others more uncomfortable when just walking by(shouting out,etc.) is the issue, a rooted problem that must and eventually will be addressed.

That's what a ugly long economic recession will do to a culture...exposes and addresses...finally!

Bring it on and let's make this a better community!

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Not under a rock, just acknowledging that the discussion is based on "everybody knows it's the blacks" and not the stats published here or elsewhere (which might very well back up what you say).

When you say "it is what it is" -- I'd clarify what it is, is "common knowledge" in your point of view.

That's okay by me.

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Correct, TAP. This was an assault of some sort rather than a robbery, at least as it played out.

I'd like to add about racial identifications: I don't use them in my reporting unless relevant and part of a description specific enough to be useful. I wouldn't say, "The victim reported being set upon by two white teens wearing jeans and T-shirts." But I passed along this crime report verbatim because I think how others see the world around them, how they react to a situation and how they assess risk is part of this or any story. Race, undeniably, has an influence on perceptions in Little Rock, Ark., USA circa 2011. See the many years of UALR polling on racial attitudes, by and about people of different background, for statistical measure.

http://ualr.edu/racialattitudes/county/

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More cops are needed in the River Market. Memphis has tons of cops on Beale. Same for Bourbon St., many of them on horseback. Our city depends on tourism and convention business much more than most residents realize. If we can't provide an environment in our entertainment district where residents and visitors feel safe, we will begin to lose that business. It's not a good thing when the folks staying at the Capitol and Peabody are discouraged by staff from walking down to the River Market because it's unsafe, but that's what's happening right now. Add cops, widen their patrol routes, and run off loiters.

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Thanks Max for this link..

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Buckshot, just logged on and read your suggestion and it was one I had thought about also---mounted patrols. They improve crowd control, are more visible, and (big bonus) improve community relations .

Here are some articles about them:

http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/police/abo…

http://www.thesoulofahorse.com/HoustonPatr…

http://what-when-how.com/police-science/mo…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mount…

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I’m always SO terrified when I see groups of young black women and men ahead of me on the street at night. It happens all the time. In NY, LA, Vegas, The Rock, you name it.

‘Course, I’m always in some sort of small group or just a couple of us or something because we’ve been somewhere together and are headed somewhere else together and who, anywhere, anyway, when you look like I, walks streets at night alone?

Goodbye, South is right. Here’s the thing.

Last year, n NYC, five of us (male, female, straight, gay, all white) walked home from the Lucille Lortel in the Village. Along 46th, I think. Ahead, under construction scaffolding, a group of black men. My darling friend Linda whispered, “Should we cross the street?”

I shot back, “Are you fucking kidding? What do you want ‘em to do? CHASE us? Please.”

So we kept right on going. I spoke to them first, with a nod and a smile, as we walked past.

“How you guys?”

“Whaz hap’nin, mama?”

“Nut’n much. You behavin’?” They laughed.

“We tryin’ to. You have a good one.”

“Stay real.”

So much for all the anticipated street-thug interracial drama.

OR, year before last, in The Rock.

Two adorable white women friends and I were invited by a black friend of mine to go down to Jazzy’s on 12th or Asher or wherever-the-hell it is to hear a group from Pine Bluff, because nothing was happening at the club where we were. I’d been to Jazzy’s before, knew some of the bartenders (Lee Ann was there at the time) but my girlfriends NEVER had.

GOD, were they uncomfortable. Grown women giggling like adolescents with excitement and fear at the “forbidden.” I felt sorry for them. They’d obviously never been the only white in a black establishment in their lives. I just thought they were silly. Still do.

Going into Jazzy’s I stopped outside because the group from Pine Bluff was standing around smoking and I’d heard them before and they remembered me too. So I told my party to order me a beer and I’d be in in a minute. I talked with the Pine Bluff musicians and finally went inside.

My two women friends barely lasted one beer. One whispered, “We’re not comfortable. I think we’re going to leave.”

I just grinned. “We’ll walk you out to your car. What do you think’s gonna happen? You’re gonna get raped? You should BE so lucky.” (Tasteful humor, as you know, is my trademark, Razorbabies.)

My point’s the same as Goodbye, South.

ANYBODY, in any city, knows where not to go; where things really ARE always dangerous.

ANY late-night entertainment and bar-district in ANY city will have more “bad” types and crimes. Beale Street in Memphis. The entire Las Vegas Strip. Does that stop you from going and enjoying?

If you’re unfamiliar and frightened, yep. If you’re white and never hung out with blacks, yep. If you’re straight and up-tight around gays, yep.

Let me tell you something, Razorbabies, that Goodbye, South already knows.

Street criminals smell “victims” a block away. Their radar homes in on people frightened of them and ready to be “victimized.”

I’m not talking about armed robbers high on God-knows-what rushing into convenience stores to hold up tills. I’m talking about street crimes.

Does your River Market need more police? Sure.

Meanwhile, you’ve got racist whites secretly terrified of blacks because they’ve never bothered to know any, wandering around AFRAID they’ll be hurt, half-EXPECTING to be assaulted and robbed, “unconsciously” parking in spots where they’re more likely to run into trouble than if they valet-parked. (Are you kidding me? A $10 enclosed public parking lot on Main Street? Go into the Capital Bar and Grille, have a drink, pay the $10 to the valet instead and forget about courting all the drama.)

Get your politicians to pay for more police, instead of railing against bars in entertainment districts being open to five a.m.

Vegas is 24/7/365, and does just fine, thanks. Crime? Sure. Like everywhere. No state taxes? You betcha. Drunks, prostitutes, pickpockets, murderers? Charles Dickens all over again.

The French Quarter "makes" The Big Easy. Beale Street “makes” Memphis. The River Market “makes” The Rock. The Strip “makes” Vegas.

Fun? Great entertainment? You betcha.

Grow up and wise up. If you’re too freaked out to engage in passing with street people (why, they’re EVERYWHERE), too unnerved and threatened that city existence isn’t a Hallmark Card from '50s Harrison, stay home. Stare at the HD plasma on your wall and pretend you’re living Real Life through Comcast.

Thanks, Goodbye, South.

I too love the night life.

And I LOVE police!

(P.S. Wanna read a great book on this topic? "The Gift of Fear." Gavin De Becker.)

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Agreed, Max, that race is ever with us. That's why I agree with yapperjohn that honest discussion is needed. I wasn't taking issue with his post on that point.

I guess I look like a fairly good target when I'm out, but I don't feel any more or less threatened passing through a throng of mostly white kids awaiting or exiting a concert at Juanita's than I do passing through a similar number of mostly black kids congregating in the River Market. And if most of the crime in the River Market is perpetrated by blacks, that alone does not transform one group into "thugs" while the other remains kids.

It seems that many of the crimes reported from the River Market involve stickup men alone or in groups of two or three striking at a dark and opportune moment. Does that relate to a throng of kids, of any race? I'm not prepared to say it does, but I'm open to discussion.

If race is part of the discussion I'd offer a couple of kernels for thought. (1) The (citizen, not city) "warning" that went out days before a national meeting here of college-educated men from a predominately black Greek-letter fraternity a couple of years ago; and (2) the kids-will-be-kids response to Hot Springs skateboarders -- one of whom wrested a companion from the grasp of an officer and fled full speed up the street.

I can't say what these things mean. I think they mean something.

So, yes; perception is a part of the honest discussion that is needed.

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TAP, as you know, I adore you unless I'm pissed off with you momentito. Which I'm currently not.

And I'm a bit young to remember, but may I inquire?

Is your current avatar one of the Village People? Does it convey some trans-orientational hands-across-the-chasm same-sex-equality significance?

Does it have historic Civil War resonance?

Is a child missing a pet ferret?

It looks unnervingly like my last husband and I'm curious where you found this because it just revives the whole sordid thing.

Thank you.

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MAYBE ALL THE BLACK MEMBERS OF THE TEA PARTY SHOULD START SOME TYPE OF RECREATION PROGRAM.

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We drove across the bridge last night around 1:30 on the way home from the AR Queen trip. As we passed this location, there were several hundred youth standing around on corners right where the shooting happened. When we tried to make the turn onto 3rd, pedestrians were blocking the roadway and harassing motorists in their vehicles. We had to veer around three young men standing in the roadway who were staring at us while blocking traffic. They were being cheered on by a group of twenty or so young women on the sidewalk. I've lived in a city of 3 million and have visited most large metro areas of the US. I've never experienced anything like what I saw last night. Never seen anything like this in LR.

I've been here most of my life, and what I saw last night will prevent me from patronizing any business in the River Market area after the workday rush is over. I'm sure glad I didn't move into Block 2. The area is simply not safe.

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Norma, Keep up please, Tap has sent his hat to me...to eat! [See UofA president search thread].

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Norma - that is Deputy U.S. Marshal Bass Reeves from Judge Parker's court - without his hat.

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Blacks commit the majority of crime.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_crim…

Why? It's hard (and controversial) to say. It's a widely debated question.

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Nanc --

I couldn't care less about Tap's hat. But a Chia Pet on his upper lip? Where is shame?

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Calmwriter, thank you for posting. What you write proves that the problem goes beyond the usual explanations, and also proves that there is great cause for deep concern.

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On Dickson's entertainment district Fayetteville wisely chose to put policia on bicycles. No glaring authoritarian police uniforms, just officers with official shirts and shorts on what appears to be mountain bikes.

It's amazing what they find as the bikes allow them alley access to star quarterbacks snorting up large quantities of cocao powder.

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Things are not likely to get any better until the city of Little Rock adopts a residency requirement for their uniformed public safety department employees. Want to hold down a job as a cop or fireman ? ......you gotta live within the city limits. And put two officers back in the patrol cars or walking a beat in pairs. No more take-home patrol cars to NLR, Bryant, Sherwood, Cabot, etc. Where' Mr. Kersey when we need him?

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I have a new hat on order, Norma. As soon as it arrives, I'll trim my mustache to a reasonable size. I feel naked without one or the other.

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Norma- Your story about getting cheeky with the guys under the bridge reminds me of that aspiring actress that got lippy with some hoodlums in NYC a few years ago: before they shot her dead. You're very open minded and hip, and you're clearly not a victim of violent crime.

Goodbye, South- Your first post is the equivalent of asking a rape victim what she was wearing that night. What the hell difference does it make if they didn't make eye contact with these thugs? I could give a crap if they made eye contact, and I hope the driver bumped a few of them with his car on the way out. You're letting your racial sensitivity and guilt get between you and reality.

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If real estate developers create an artificial "entertainment district" where one never existed and if that "entertainment district" consists after dark solely of a bunch of bars serving young people, why would anyone be surprised when those young people get sloshed and cause trouble after midnight?

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Ive on been to Beale Street once, on New Years Eve, very early on. we ate and walked most of Beale and looked at the beautiful churches down there before the entertainment district. we spent over two hours down there and saw one cop, and he was leaving.

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The River Market is growing. Given the business volume and tax revenue generation represented in the area, it is important to solve problems rather than exhibit shortsightendness and absolutism. We need more police presence. Hire them.
Dont shoot-taze, then try them in a court of law. Ignore white and black racists.
No one deserves to be beaten because they didnt engage in conversation. Socially appropriate behavior is the goal. Dont defend the behavior of violent people...black or white. The Public Safety Bill is not made worthless by these events. Juanita's application should not be denied because of these events. Spend another 200-300k
on police protection. Where can it come from? Audit entitlements. Implement austerity programs. Government should be accountable for intelligent spending as we are. Be more careful with contract awards. I could go on but the point is made. This district generates a hell of a lot of revenue. Apply the revenue to real solutions. Finally, do be very careful not to profile. Facts are facts. Let it be...but remember, fear and suspicion begats hatred. There are many, many good AA kids living, working and going to school in this area...just coming to have dinner and catch a show in the RMD. One group of reckless youths dont need to write the key chapter for race relations in the RM-Little Rock. Do not punish these kids on a wholesale level. Do not defend assaulters because of skin color, either. Find the few and deal with them. Acknowledge the value of the RM to LR. Every nonviolent human being should be welcome and treated respectfully.

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Claude, you think the guys involved in this were coming back from the River Market bars?

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What B.S. Life's all about Attitude.

I've got it. Most don't. Can't help it. I was born this way.

Murderers, rapists, extortionists, druggies, wife-beaters, prosties, trannies, Republicans . . . I've known 'em all. I really have.

They're fascinating. They know they are. They know I am too. They love me for knowing I know they are. I love them for knowing I know they know. We just talk.

I'm not a cop. I'm not a judge or jury. I'm not afraid. What're they gonna do? KILL me? ROB me? RAPE me? WHY? I'm on a first-name basis within 60 seconds.

They're just human beings looking to get over, like me only less fabulous.

Have you ever TALKED with one? Sat down and asked questions? Shared a square? Shown any interest? What have you got to lose? What have you got to learn?

They're FAR more interesting and informative and insightful than frightened little pre-fab religionists parroting Bible college dogma so they can "fit in" with zombies, but don't go by me.

My point is that somebody last night or somewhere talked about Sister-'s and WBW's wedding and mentioned something about that one-man Village People act which they said was taken off YouTube so of course I resurrected it for my Razorbabies and here it is except it's my understanding that Tap and Durango are replicating some Nicholas Brothers routine for the nuptials so this probably doesn't matter to anybody except The Amazing Christopher who's still available for bookings as far as I know.

Celebrity jaws dropped back in the day.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ivV8ifvjGc

If you ever see this on President Clinton Avenue in the River Market, throw money and cheer.

Have fun, Razorbabies. Stay happy.

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Yes, Fayetteville police are the best. They love to pick up intoxicated students who choose to walk home from Dickson versus driving and hand out PI's. I always wonder what they think they are encouraging and I guess they want to increase the revenue of DUI's. Go figure.

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Race is not the reason. Poverty is. The youths hanging around the entertainment district at 2 in the morning could not afford the access to the clubs that the people who were leaving could. They are poor, and they are angry. They would be angry if they were white. Their anger is based upon not being able to get a job, not being able to pull themselves out of the hopelessness of subsistence living in an urban ghetto. You see the same things in barrios of Los Angeles. You saw the same things years ago with the Italian street gangs in New York. Until we find a way in this country to see that everyone can find a job and make a decent living we are going to find this. If you were a poor kid who has no place to go but down and you saw a white, drunk Yuppie staggering up the street after a night of having a good time, would you not be tempted to put a little fear into him?

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Really plainjim?

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This conversation - with all manner of views. -- is why i love blogging.

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After reading the original report, I have a question, which I'm afraid will go unanswered: Is the driver in the report sure he didn't whack his car into someone or something before the violence started, when he put his car into reverse and started to leave? That wouldn't make the attack right, but it would explain what started it.

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I don't know, plainjim, but if it turns out this was a hate crime sparked by nothing more than the "differentness" of the two victims, I wouldn't have a problem with an enhanced penalty for those convicted. Sauce for the goose and all that. . . .

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Tap, Love your mustache, don't get to razor happy.

Can men today grow a mustache like that?

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