Arkansas Blog

Remind me again why we're so afraid of Iran's theocracy.

Oh yeah, it's because they're worshipping the wrong god, if they were worshipping our god then we'd all be happy.

Organized religion is Satan's greatest invention.

If a pastor truly feels that a candidate's views are wrong and can prove this biblically with out cherry picking; then by all means it is his job to advise his congregation accordingly.

But if that same pastor is receiving any kind of support from the Gov. then he will find it hard to prove that his sermon are unsolicited.

And how would this be different from the last two presidential races?

I know of two preachers from my hometown that told their parishioners that it was their godly duty to vote for President Shit for Brains. There was no subtle innuendo/pressure, they told them from the pulpit and told them in the Sunday School classes. Of course it backfired because the two who told me their stories we're pissed off about their church, their God being used thusly.

Some pastors will undoubtedly participate with this proposal, but I would think many would have been so burned by their own involvement in 2000 and 2004 and the cost to the nation, that they might decide their job is to minister to the souls of the congregation, not guide their politics.

Bad idea - BAD idea!

Zelda exposes the "tip of the iceberg!" People in the real world have NO CLUE the kind of 'devilish' stuff that is preached in these especially rural churches, by folks whose credentials are what?: They've been "called." Beam 'em up, Scotty...

I've been called to be as Brad Pitt - so far it's not working out...but I have FAITH!!! ;>)
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How many remember why he was elected?
I do! He has not done more than one thing we elected the liar for.

Chasv,
Most of us couldn't figure out why he was elected in the first place, so we don't know why you all voted for him. haha.

Zelda's right on this one...this isn't news, it's a recycled news story. But, I still think HuckaBush is gonna use this precise method to torpedo McCainal, so I don't think this works for the old man's advantage. In fact, if you read the article, no where in it does it refer to helping get Ol' Flip-Flop McCain elected.

I think President Obama should look into changing this tax-exempt thing with the churches across the land. You know our founding fathers never imagine a day when there'd be mega-churches with preachers riding around in big Cadillacs and flying their private planes all over the world to raise money for their pockets. Not a single Son of '76 imagined a Ronnie Floyd, much less a Huckabee-ite TV preacher like Kenneth Copeland.

I'm sure they never thought a Catholic priest would be bending over a little altar boy to give special ministering to his little boy bottom. Church is big bidness these days and wouldn't all of us have a pile of cash in our pockets if we didn't have to pay taxes. After all, it says to render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, and I don't see these churches rendering anything except our Constitution in these modren times.

Make the churches pay their fair share of taxes and let em rip! It's impossible to keep a man or woman from finally letting out what's on their mind. As shepherds of their flock, they're gonna let it out sometime and last thing we need is a bunch of preachers crowding our prisons cause their tongues got them in trouble. Plus free speech is such a sticky wicket......pay your damn taxes and speechify till Christ and the cows come home to roost. The nice side effect of making churches pay taxes is that they might then start building Parking Garages for Jesus and quit eating up their neighborhoods like a wildfire.

You all worry so much about global warming....I know from experience when churches knock down everything around them to make parking lots it changes the weather pattern in the neighborhood. It gets a lot hotter in the summer and colder in the winter and the wind seems to blow hard 24-7. Save the earth! Save our political system! Save free speech! Tax the Churches!

Tis nothing new. Politic and preachers mixing is as old as America. Read Frederick Lewis Allen's book, "Only Yesterday" and take a trip back to the early part of the 20th century as preachers attacked Woodrow Wilson for promoting "Romanism and low cut gowns and music inspired by Satan." Another good book is written by Dr. Willard Gatewood and the title is "Preacher, Pedagogues and Politicians."

We are what we are because of our past. We cannot cut ourselves from the past. These two books make all of this very clear.

"We cannot cut ourselves from the past." cato
Disgustingly true, Cato, but ain't it about time we started trying?
DBI for tax assessor and collector.

Well said Cato.

It is not like a member of one of these churches was just about to vote for Obama until the pastor stopped him. He might influence a few. But, if these are the votes Obama needs to get elected he is in trouble. Even Hillary with her support from the non-college graduate, hard working Americans is not going to make much of an end road here.

"Churches are free to be as politically active as they choose if they do not claim tax exemptions."

Research project for Max: How many are there who don't claim, as a percentage of those who do? Sounds like a good contest - I'm guessing 1.35% (probably WAY high...)
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As man is there is nothing new. Man's the same old rotten sinner he, all of us, have been since Adam and Eve...
There is nothing new under the sun.

Fletch, you would be surprised at how many poor, hard-working church members vote as they are led to vote - against their own interests - because it is "the Christian" thing to do. I almost pull my hair out with relatives who hate everything Bush does, but everytime the preacher tells them Bush was the only thing standing between them and Gays - they couldn't wait to go vote for him again.

C1.c1, After all that's said and done your family can plainly see that voting against queers for anything is the only thing they had to vote for that mattered.
They are not as dumb as you may think they are!

That is WHY I SAID THE BEST THING GOING FOR THE REPUBLICANS IS THE DAMN DEMOCRAP HEAD PARTY.
When you die hard liberal democraps get your brains out of your assesssssss and back where it belongs then maybe we'll get a better adminstration................... DAmn I hate we have to vote for the lesser of twoooo evils...
Queers have brought dowm too many judgements from heaven and if america becomes a sodom and gomorroh then american will be no more.

dbi, the church members pays taxes. So, if the church is made to pay taxes that is the same as the members paying 2X for the offerings they give.

Repent and be born again before it is too late. You and only you can guarantee your future will not be in hell where the worms dies not and the flame is unquenchable.

I think taxation of churches should remain off the table (the personal income tax level of the jet setting preachers is another matter)... free speech at the pulpit should be exempt from government scrutiny, imo. Churches should not be able to lobby outside of the the church in any political manner, except over their own taxation issues or zoning matters etc.

Any financial /political lobbying expenditures by Churches should be illegal. Taxing it would just say it's OK to blend church and state.

Someone said the other day, that one of the four horsemen of the apocalypse cut him/her off in traffice that morning, and now me thinks another one of them is posting on this blog......

Ci Ci - just remove the words Hell, God, Jesus, and Devil from anything Chasv says and you will quickly see it's all the same in his world... damned if he does and damned if he doesn't, so fear everything!

I guess the scariest thing about ol' chasv is that he apparently believes what he says. Homophobia is what drives a lot of people --- energizes them, apparently --- except that phobia seems too mild a term. Panic stricken seems more apt. Hyperventilating. Approaching apoplexy. It would be comical if it weren't so sad. And these people would probably spontaneously combust if they knew how many homosexuals they come into contact with every day.

Wes, I guess you've figured out by now that tax exempt status is a nice benefit from the government. I cannot understand why churches are tax exempt and other forms of entertainment are not.

Chas, of course it would be double taxing to tax the offering plate, but we're triple and quadruple taxed all the time. When you eat at a restaurant you pay sales tax and probably a hamburger tax. The waitrons pay income taxes on their tips. Everybody who works there pays income tax for the money you were already taxed for earning that you spent there. The restaurant pays sales taxes on all the food, equipment, etc. they buy. The people who deliver food and supplies pay taxes when they gas up their delivery vehicles, and your money also helps them pay their income and property taxes. That money you spent also has to be used to pay property tax for the owner.

I could keep going, but the problem these days is so much money going to Bushco contractors to wage a useless war. Whether you'd like to see that money spent for gay abortions or not collected at all, you have to agree we're wasting it now.

My apologies to those personally affected by the human cost of the Operation Iraq Liberation (OIL) war for only touching on the financial burden of OIL. A lot of Americans have died there, and none of them should have. We're also all responsible for a lot of death and suffering among the population we "liberated."

I really worry about the impact on society of a bunch of PTSD afflicted veterans moving back into the general population. That's if this war ever ends and they ever get a chance to settle permanently back in their home country. There are going to be some seriously messed up minds coming home to every neighborhood. Unstable, unemployable, not quite so young homeless people, mostly males, feeling they are owed something for their immense sacrifice for their country. We don't take care of our vets like we should, and it's going to bite us on the ass. This new segment of society will also be well trained killing machines.

"Queers have brought dowm too many judgements from heaven and if america becomes a sodom and gomorroh then american will be no more." - Chasv

This from a man that criticizes Jeremiah Wright. I really just can't get past the hypocracy of Republican evangelicals attacking the man for making comments far more tame than the ones they listen to from their own pastors evrey Sunday. Can someone, ANYONE explain this to me? Blue name

Gays sin less than Christian fundamentalists. Here is why.

No gay has ever caused a war, but Christian fundamentalists got us into Iraq.

The dead Americans, high gas prices, and a recession are all parts of God's judgment for that.

Christian fundamentalists misinterpret scripture in order to gain political power and influence. They treat the Bible as a whore for hire, as an idol, as a weapon.

This is not a one-time thing, but a lifestyle. A lifestyle of perverting the Gospel.

Add on to this our treatment of aliens, which is directly forbidden by Scripture yet embraced by the Right.

I smell smoke.

Thanks for the heads up, Eureka. I have relatives who think the same but didn't expect that sort of thinking here on the blog.

"Queers have brought dowm too many judgements from heaven and if america becomes a sodom and gomorroh then american will be no more." - Chasv

I can agree that they are big part of the spiritual problem in America, But I also think they had help from our gov. Trying to pass and actually passing laws that are bent on keeping pastors and preachers from preaching against their sin.

And I have said it before and I will say it again I do not believe there to have been a candidate running for office since before the election of 1856 that has truly cared for his constituents. Take care of number one and voters be damned.

Wes, I guess you've figured out by now that tax exempt status is a nice benefit from the government. I cannot understand why churches are tax exempt and other forms of entertainment are not.

Tax exemption: to some may qualify as government support. But a few pennies or even a dollar or two every April 15th is not worth my getting behind a person whose only concern is what the U.S. people can give me. There was atime when There were no pay checks for being a congressman or the president. If you did not have the money to support yourself while you were truly serving your country and your constituents There was no need in even entering the race. Also if you were not an up standing member of a christian church you did not even need to try. Several states even had this little tidbit in their own constitutions until I believe it was the 100 years.

Excuse me that was meant to be "the last hundred years"

From up Nawth , it's been interesting to watch Armani Ronnie of First Baptist fame not make a peep regarding political speech. His last utterings as a ho for Bush almost cost his very rich church their tax deductible status. IRS investigations can turn up many things some members don't wish to have revealed.

So, let these hate-mongering church go for McBush from the pulpit. The country could sure use the huge fines that can be handed out after Jan 20, 09.

Gays sin less than Christian fundamentalists. Here is why.

No gay has ever caused a war, but Christian fundamentalists got us into Iraq.

The dead Americans, high gas prices, and a recession are all parts of God's judgment for that.

Christian fundamentalists misinterpret scripture in order to gain political power and influence. They treat the Bible as a whore for hire, as an idol, as a weapon.

This is not a one-time thing, but a lifestyle. A lifestyle of perverting the Gospel.

Add on to this our treatment of aliens, which is directly forbidden by Scripture yet embraced by the Right

Yes I bet you do smell smoke.

"Gays sin less than Christian fundamentalists."

Sin is sin. less or more is not an issue.

"No gay has ever caused a war, but Christian fundamentalists got us into Iraq."

So you know for a fact and can prove that there are no homosexuals serving in or with our government?

"The dead Americans, high gas prices, and a recession are all parts of God's judgment for that."

So you are saying that every American that has ever died is a part of GOD's judgement for the war in Iraq? And something was prophecied in the book of revelation (high prices and recession) is part of GOD's judgement on America only?

"Christian fundamentalists misinterpret scripture in order to gain political power and influence. They treat the Bible as a whore for hire, as an idol, as a weapon."

Please give to me an example of what you call a "Misinterpret scripture"? And show me how all Christian fundamentalists treat the bible as a whore?

And where do they present "A lifestyle of perverting the Gospel."

And please explain "Add on to this our treatment of aliens, which is directly forbidden by Scripture yet embraced by the Right"?

If you are talking of illegal aliens; show me how we are mistreating them by giving them food, medical care, homes, and jobs where they can work and get back every penny they pay in taxes.

"Sin is sin. less or more is not an issue."

I agree with you. But I'm surprised you say that, because fundamentalists are the first to ignore the beam in their eye of greed and hate, while pointing out the splinter in the gay person's eye. Clearly there is a hierarchy of sin there, or the gay lifestyle would not be an issue.

"So you know for a fact and can prove that there are no homosexuals serving in or with our government?"

Oh, there are lots of homosexuals in the government. But it was with the active support of the Christian right that Bush was able to lead us into war, including well-publicized sermons from the pulpit. In the meantime, denominations such as the Methodists strongly opposed the war, but their views were drowned out by the right wing and not seen as "Christian."

" So you are saying that every American that has ever died is a part of GOD's judgement for the war in Iraq? And something was prophecied in the book of revelation (high prices and recession) is part of GOD's judgement on America only?

I assume you meant "American has ever did" rather than "American has ever died." Either way, that's not what I am saying at all. I'm saying you can see a simple cause and effect between the actions of fundamentalists and the consequences our nation is undergoing. Maybe you don't see God's hand at work there, but I believe it is. And I don't believe that Revelation has any literal meaning. Scripture is something that points us to God but it is not God.

"Please give to me an example of what you call a "Misinterpret scripture"? And show me how all Christian fundamentalists treat the bible as a whore?"

Well, as one easy example, the highest commandment to Love God and Thy Neighbor. Scripture is used to justify the American attachment to greed -- dog eat dog capitalism -- as holy and ordained, when clearly a government based on greed is against the entire point of the OT and NT. The Bible is treated as a whore because it is used to make money and as a reason to lobby government and accumulate power. The passages in Scripture that bolster greed, power and hate are pulled out of context, while the passages that support love (the entire point of Jesus' ministry) are ignored. The fundamentalist emphasis is on personal salvation -- love of thyself -- rather than love of God and neighbor. And on top of that, they cast other Christian denominations to hell for not believing their view of Gospel. When you use scripture to say that other Christians aren't Christians, you play God.
We all seek personal and political gain because those things give us pleasure, and when we use the Bible to get that pleasure, it becomes a whore.

"And where do they present "A lifestyle of perverting the Gospel."
See above. Since we both agree that sin is sin, is there any difference between a gay lifestyle and a greed-based lifestyle? I fear God's judgment much more for being a member of the modern Roman empire (we've got the most powerful military and economy on earth and we don't hesitate to use them, being an American citizen confers special rights, we do what is easy politically, we crucify minorities and tell them it's their own fault, etc.) than I do for anything else.

"And please explain "Add on to this our treatment of aliens, which is directly forbidden by Scripture yet embraced by the Right"? If you are talking of illegal aliens; show me how we are mistreating them by giving them food, medical care, homes, and jobs where they can work and get back every penny they pay in taxes."

We're reminded how to treat aliens because we were "once aliens (y)ourselves in Egypt". It tells us that how we treat "the least of these" is how we treat Jesus. It tell that if someone takes our coat we ought to give them our shirt. It tells us a lot of things about how to treat the poor and downtrodden. The message of Jesus was not "I've got mine, Jack, keep your hands off my stack!"

If you have a method of escaping sales, property, income or any other tax, post it here, because I'm sure we all could use it. As in the Roman Empire, it's a benefit to our country to have a class of poor lower income people to do the jobs we don't want to do, depending on us for charity to live. That's why you find Big Business opposing the anti-alien measures, because they're making money off of aliens.

I do apologize that it took me this long but there problems with my connection:

to The Levee: I will try to answer all of your statements as easily as possible.

Yes, Sin is sin. The act of adultery is no different than the act of homosexuality. GOD treats both sins the same. It is man that makes a distinction between the two. If a person dies as an adulterer they will bust hell wide open. Just as I believe the person that dies as a homosexual will spend eternity in a devils hell.

My biggest problem with your statements as well as those of others is that you all seem to want to lump all "Christian Fundamentalists" into one bag and say that it is their fault. Yes, I speak out strongly against sin in any form but I also keep the verse in mind where Bro. Paul reminds us "and such were some of you." (1 Cor. 6v9-11)While it is true that many big name jokes who call themselves christians did jump on the band wagon for reasons of their own, You must also consider that there were a lot of preachers without the big names and the glamour that not only knew what was going on; they also knew there was no way of stopping this war from happening.

These were your words "The dead Americans....are all parts of God's judgment for that." And I assumed that you were again speaking of the war in Iraq. "The dead Americans" leaves to big a field. Let us also remember that Americans have died at home, as well as in other countries. Death is a part of life it is not necessarily a part of GOD's judgement. The KJV teaches that we are judged in our lives and by our lives. Death is nothing more than a doorway from this walk of life to the next.

And as far as this recession we are experiencing look at the book of Revelation 6v5-6:
And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand. And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and [see] thou hurt not the oil and the wine.
You can assuredly declare this a judgement of GOD; but not just against the U.S. rather it is against the world as a whole. When this passage of scripture was written a penny was a full day's wages. Wheat and Barley were and still the ingredients for a loaf of bread. The balances do indicate the judgements of GOD. But his passage is a prophecy that the prices for all things would go up dramatically as they have and are continuing to do so. What has this got to do with today? Well if the price of oil goes up then the price of fuel goes up. We use this fuel to gather and carry our goods to market so the price for our goods will increase accordingly. Now remember the prophecy said a measure of wheat for a penny. A measure of wheat makes one loaf of bread, so it may be that some time in the near future we will be paying a full day's wages just to buy a loaf of bread.

Yes GOD does say that the two greatest commandments are these:
"And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments [is], Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this [is] the first commandment. And the second [is] like, [namely] this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these." (Mark 12v29-31) This same question is asked in Mat. 22v34-40 and as well as Luke 10v25-28. But only in the passage of scripture in Luke do we see the qualifications for a neighbour (10v29-37). Yes we are taught to show love and to show mercy. And if a man needs to come knock on my door for help I have no problem extending my hand to do so. But please show me in which scriptures it tells me that I must help the man sneaking through my back door. Many people love to cite Luke 6v29 as you did saying that we need do nothing if someone steals from us: And unto him that smiteth thee on the [one] cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloke forbid not [to take thy] coat also. They walk away see all you want to do is teach hate. Let's put this vers together with Mat. 5v39-40: But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have [thy] cloke also. And we have a better understanding as to what JESUS was saying. Now we can also add to this: And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. (Luke 12v39) Mat. 24v43 says the same thing. Is JESUS teaching hate and greed; GOD forbid. But he giving us the Christian right and obligation to protect and defend the things that GOD has blessed us with. Does this mean that I can shut up the bowels of compassion when I see my "Brother" in need; GOD Forbid. If I do this How then do I show the love of GOD in me. Don't sneak into my house, just come knock on my door.

But if any provide not for his own, and especially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel. (1 Ti. 5v8) Providing for your own house is not being greedy; it is called being a good Stewart. It is what you do with the blessings of GOD that label one as being greedy.

If a person teaches the love of oneself over the love of GOD, then just like any other sinner that person will bust hell wide open.

"And on top of that, they cast other Christian denominations to hell:" Show me how you are not doing the same thing to those whom you "Christian Fundamentalists."

"We all seek personal and political gain because those things give us pleasure, and when we use the Bible to get that pleasure, it becomes a whore." Yes the bible does teach us that when we put the love of pleasure over the love of GOD, then we will die in our sins. But if GOD chooses to bless even a rank sinner then who am I, or who are you, to say that it is wrong. My bible says it rains on the just as well as the unjust. Remember in Ecclesiastes King Solomon taught that if GOD blesses the unjust that it would soon run over to the just. We all and this includes you, need to sit back and give GOD the praise and glory for his love and mercy. Friend; I am on a fixed income and work 24 -32 hours a week just to help make ends meet. I live in a community that is full of ill-legal aliens and some if not most of them know my and myself and are friends of ours. They have come to my aid when I needed it and I hope that they can say the same of me. But will I vote for the passing of any law that gives them any legal status or support in this country; NO!

"being an American citizen confers special rights;" Please show which this occurs, I am due a vacation. I had the same thoughts when I was in the Marines, Guess what I found out How wrong those thoughts were. I saw many a man murdered just because he was an American.

"We're reminded how to treat aliens because we were "once aliens (y)ourselves in Egypt". It tells us that how we treat "the least of these" is how we treat Jesus. It tell that if someone takes our coat we ought to give them our shirt. It tells us a lot of things about how to treat the poor and downtrodden. The message of Jesus was not "I've got mine, Jack, keep your hands off my stack!" See; I have already answered this.

"If you have a method of escaping sales, property, income or any other tax, post it here;"
I will tell you how someone in the local revenue office explained it to. They have a baby born in this country to get a social security number, since a baby born in the U.S. is a legal citizen. They will then have as many a dozen adults using that same Social Security number. Then come tax only one person files under that social security number, and guess what, some body gets back a whole bunch of money. What do they do with it after that? Your guess is as good as mine. I was working Gate Guard for a local factory that had a reputation for hiring ill-legals. The factory was told that INS was coming within the next week and I was told one night to open the Gate and every one out. As they were leaving (about 2/3 of the workers) I asked what the problem was and to a man was told that because they did not have a valid social security number they would not get paid. After INS did their thing these people were hired back on.

Thanks Wes!

It says not to remove the ancient landmarks, i.e., borders of old time! The Rio Grand is a landmark, border, established years ago, just as the ocean is our border separating us from foriegn lands.

Thanks Wes!

You are welcome.